2005 Toyota Tacoma!!!

[expeditionswest]

Here is the 05 Tacoma...

Bed Length: 74.5"
Bed Width: 63.2"
Bed Depth: 17"

Length: 207"
Width: 71.8"
Wheelbase: 127.4"

New motor: 4.0 liter 240hp V6 with optional TRDsuper charger for 300+hp

Compared to the 04 extended cab, the wheelbase will be 5" longer, with a 4" wider track.

Press release: http://www.toyota.com/about/news/product/2004/02/04-1-tacomaXrunner.html

The model they released at the Chicago Auto show is the 2wd sport version, but the 4wd will have the same motor and dimensions, and thankfully not the ground effects. The vehicle will be available in summer.

I thought everyone might appreciate this!






Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[BajaXplorer]

4.0 liter engine - Good!
Hummer chasis - Bad!

[MrS]

Looks like I'll be keeping the 01 model longer, unless I get finished with it.

Thanks

KF6YSB

[JackSilb]

It seems they are focusing on the street consumers.

Thanks for sharing the info.
-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[BajaTaco]

http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/headscratch.gifhttp://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif


http://www.bajataco.com

[JackSilb]

Baja,

Is this a real picture of some photoshop work?

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[expeditionswest]

http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/baja_rofl.gif That rack looks familiar...

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[BajaTaco]

http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif That is the 4x4 version of the new Tacoma. The rack with accessories is a factory option, as is the tube rear bumper with 1/4 panel protection, and the front bumper...

http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/joker1.gif

Just kidding - that is a little computer enhancement of the new body style modified a bit and overlayed onto my truck. I colored the camper shell to match.


http://www.bajataco.com

[JackSilb]

Good job! If it was not for the wheels and roof rack, I would not get it.

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[BajaTaco]

Ok, here it is! Click on the thumbnails attached

It looks pretty big. I think with some sawzall mods it could be really cool. But dang, that looks bulky! I would love to try it on a trip though and see how it does.





BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

Post Edited (BajaTaco) : 8/9/2004 6:58:28 PM (GMT-8)

[BajaTaco]

Clipped from another post regarding the 2004 TTORA takeover and the '05 4x4 showcased at the event...

******

They also had the '05 Taco 4x4 there for a viewing, but I guess the agreement was that no pics could be shown. Here are some good notes that were provided regarding the new 4x4...

Quote from Will... "They brought a VERY bright RED DC V6 TRD. The interior is all new design with seperate gauges silver trim etc. It is a little wider I think they said 3-4". One cool thing is they moved the oil filter, it is now at the top drivers side, really easy to get too. i think the ground clearence and everything is about the same. I was told by someone that it is now built on the new 4Runner chassis"


Quote from David... "The fenders are just like the new 4-runner, with large plastic fenders flares... that are just about in the right place to be cut for making larger wheel well openings.


The locker is still there, although the 4wd is now the electric dial on the dash, no stick for the xfer case.


Double cab will have an available 6-speed manual... Weeeeeee.!!!


Suspension setup in front is simular to the new 4-runner, with the rack and pinion in front of the suspension and up higher instead of behind. Looks like same coils, a-arms, as now, but not verified. CV's are a new beefier type it looks like, the inner tulip has been replaced with what could be a full CV joint, shafts are thicker. Same front diff as we have now, so ARB's, etc will fit.


As for the dash, it's very close to the new 4-runner look.


Engine is the new 4.0 VVTI 245hp V-6. No word on a v-8.


The only realy bad thing I saw on it is the crossover for the exaust hangs below the tranny now instead of up and over, and at least on this prototype it hangs even lower than the xfer case crossmember. It's going to be the first thing to get smashed. Already came up with a fix for it - dual exausts.. 8-)


Otherwise, the front was very well protected, looks like the radiator was moved higher, beefer skid plates, and the rack being moved forward and up out of the way. The tie rods did look a bit thin though.


Rear seating on the double cab is bigger. Storage compartments built in behind the seats, nice big center console. Rear bed is a new composite type, with storage built into the sides and adjustable dividers.


All in all, except for the stupid crossover pipe, I liked it and wasn't disapointed with it.


Actully, at least for me, it was better than expected.. after hearing all the rumors. It's still a bit mall runner looking, but they kept some of the important stuff, and added a few unexpected ones (6 speed manual in a double cab!! Weeeee!) The looks and interior are more geared towards the average daily driver who will never take it off-road, and a nice comforatable seating, but they still kept it very off-roadable (except the stupid crossover pipe..) I was dreading it actually turning into a Camery.


Oh yeah, the holy shit handbars on the front window pillers are back too.. lol.."


***************


And another recent comment from David regarding the photos posted above...


<!--StartFragment -->"...It's pretty much like the one we saw in Tahoe, without the Westin bumper and a few other realy minor cosmetic stuff.. The picts look like they were taken with a wide angle lens from up close, which is why the 2nd pict the front end looks so big, in person it's not that bad... "


BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[expeditionswest]

Good looking truck! I do like it. Not sure about the extra size though.


It will probably end up being a better overall truck with the exception of the tight, extreme trails.


Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[BajaTaco]

Finally (http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/2005/toyota/tacoma/firstdrive/page1.html)






BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[JackSilb]

Oho, very truckish. I like it. Glad it is not a cut on a 04 4Runner

Is there a double cab already?

It seems the size I would like to have one. Bigger than an actual Tacoma, smaller than a Tundra.
Who is getting one soon so we can play?



-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[BajaTaco]

JackSilb said...

Is there a double cab already?
Yea - 4 bed/cab configurations. The d-cab is available with either a 5 foot or 6 foot bed.


BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[expeditionswest]

6 foot bed! cool

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[BajaTaco]

Scott Brady said...
6 foot bed! cool


With the D-cab? Bye bye BOA! http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/joker1.gif 141" WB!


BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[expeditionswest]

True, but would make such a cool dedicated expedition rig :) That would be one hell of a set of sliders, huh?

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[Rockcrawler]

Holy crap! My dodge is 140.5'!!!! That is going to be one long 'mini' truck! It is more dakota/canyon size now though, right?


"Paved Roads: Another example of wasteful government spending." KD7UEH

[expeditionswest]

Oh, Rockcrawler, you have got to check out the new Dodge Power wagon! Front and rear lockers, rocker protection, 12,000 lb winch, full length skid plates, disconnectable swaybars, 4.56 gears, etc.

No joke! The truck will be out for 05. I am working on getting one from the press fleet for a little test session :)


Edit: Here is a link to more info... (http://www.dodge.com/dodge_life/news/truck_news/power_wagon.html?context=dodge_life-news-truck_news-govt_crash_test&amp;type=promo2?tsrc=ram_2500_3500&amp;tgr p=promo2&amp;tname=power_wagon)

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

Post Edited (Scott Brady) : 8/31/2004 3:13:03 PM (GMT-8)

[Rockcrawler]

I've seen it! That thing is going to be a beast! If only it came with a diesel.... that would be the ultimate tow/recovery vehicle! I think it is coming with essentially 33s from the factory as well.


"Paved Roads: Another example of wasteful government spending." KD7UEH

[GoodTimes]

Yes, 33's from the factory, and as Scott mentioned, sway bar disconnects.....not normal sway bar disconnects, but push-button disconnects!

Scott, if you do get one, you gotta call me so I can come up and check it out! I want to look into the suitability of using the DC sway bar disco's on a jeep.....


olllllllo <---- If you can read that, roll me over.

KG6OWO

Price is soon forgotton, quality is not.

[expeditionswest]

I filled out the press form yesterday, now it needs approval. We can pick up the ram and the new Unlimited Rubicon with a 6-speed manual... :) Keep your fingers crossed!

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[Rockcrawler]

I'm in! :) we'll help ya test em out. Now where is that evil smiley???


Seriously though... if you do get your hands on em... I wouldn't mind crawling around under em for a bit.


"Paved Roads: Another example of wasteful government spending." KD7UEH

[JackSilb]

I hope Toyota will see it too and get some front and bacl lockers back in a truck and suv. I am so gald someone is doing it.

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[David A. Wright]

4x4 activation via dash mount dial, eh? UGH! http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/notme.gif Unfortunately, my '02 Taco was equipped with the 4x4 activation button in the side of the transfer case HI/LO lever. I don't care for it, but I liked the way the rest of the truck was equipped, so bought the truck anyway. The current 4x4 button would make a better place for the locker activation button.

The '05 finally has a clock you can actually read without having to resort to contortions while driving and subsequent off road excursions at 70mph from the highway.

USA TODAY auto writer James R. Healey's Test Drive
Toyota Tacoma: A contender
2005 model is better than predecessor but it's still crude.
http://e.usatoday.com/a/tBBb-i0AQc52PATfL$aAKgah7Rb/usat34-1

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[JackSilb]

I want to see it so I can compare to the Tundra. Not that big?

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[Creeper]

Only 9.5 inches of ground clearance? Down from 11.2 on the previous line up....http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/headscratch.gif


Well it should make loading up soccer balls and WalMart bagseasier for all of the stepford wives.


Here's the latest from Toyota on specs, options andfinally, 2005 MSRP'sas releasedyesterday -


2005 Tacoma Press Releases (http://pressroom.toyota.com/photo_library/display.html?kw=Tacoma)


If you come to a fork in the road, take it.

[David A. Wright]

Lower, eh? Should keep the lift companies VERY happy. Probably much to do with proposed legislation to keep vehicle height "equal" so that little cars aren't hurt when they butt heads with big ones. And it seems to be the factory trend to geld 4x4's because only a small number of us really use them for what they are intended for anyway. Hence, huge shiny wheels with rubber band tires on Land Rovers (ask Cecile about that one ...).

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[BajaTaco]

I dunno, I saw a pic of one parked next to an older Tacoma, and it didn't look any lower to me. That 11" that they claimed before was bogus anyway, in my opinion. Maybe now they are actually measuring at the lowest point.

[EDIT] I found out that the picture I was referring to, was a... lifted 2005. It turns out that Donahoe Racing has been given an '05 to do some R&amp;D on a new aftermarket lift, and they will have the truck at SEMA. So I will be sure to get lots of pics for everyone!

This is what Dylan from Donahoe posted on the main TTORA forum:

<!--StartFragment -->
"From initial cycling of the stock suspension it looks like we will be able to get REALLY GOOD performance from even a stock A-arm vehicle. Probably more than 9” of wheel travel. CV and tie rod angels look happy up to 3” or maybe more inches of lift with just a coilover.
</o:p>
Aftermarket rim availability for this truck may be a little limited at first.
The stock back space is about 5.25” making any 3.25 to 3.75” backspace wheel out of the question. I will be experimenting with different wheel tire combos and will let you know soon. I am having a custom set of deep back space wheels machined for me right now. The caliper is also much larger so some wheels may interfere with that, I haven’t tried a 15” yet but so far Im gona guess that it won’t fit, but with more tire sizes being available for 16,17 and 18” wheels it shouldn’t be a problem I’m sure all the wheel manufacturers will get up to speed quickly because most new vehicles are going to deeper backspace.
</o:p>
My first impression of this truck……………….IT KICKS ASS!!!!!!!"

And here is a pic of the '05 with the prototype DR coilover...









BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

Post Edited (BajaTaco) : 10/17/2004 7:12:12 PM (GMT-8)

[BajaTaco]

More info from Dylan:

<!--StartFragment -->
"Stock it has about 4” of droop and we add another inch which makes 5” but you don’t want to run it at max droop with no down travel left. I have it at 3” right now and its vary happy with plenty of down travel left. The old trucks at 3.5” with stock arms are close to maxed out with very little down travel remaining….not so good.
I will experiment with the 05 running it closer and closer to max and see when it starts to get pissed. I will let you know…….right now looks like 3” will be the recommended for the 4X4 as apposed to 2.5” on the old trucks."


BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[JackSilb]

I like the picture with the other Tacos.
It seems more like a bigger truck front.

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[bretedge]

Does anyone have an idea of how long it usually takes before lift kits are available for new trucks? I'd be curious to see who is coming out with what for the '05 Taco and when. Haven't been able to find anything on the internet yet.

[BajaTaco]

Donahoe Racing is supposed to have their coilovers for the front of the '05 Taco ready for sale by sometime in Dec. '04.This will be offered with Deaver leafs for a complete lift. Or if you wanted to get the rear set up for a custom application, you could go through Deaver or Alcan.


The Donahoe/Deaver combowill probably be one of the best lift options for the new Taco, so it's cool that they will have the stuff available so quickly. I'm sure the"drop bracket" kits (for lifting it more than 3") will take some time to get to the market though.Something interesting to note on the new Tacos is that the spring shackles in the rear are inverted. It will be interesting to see what people end up doing with this.


BTW, the new Taco is finally on the Toyota website - http://www.toyota.com/html/redirects/home/tacoma_img.html


Something I noticed is that all of the D-cabs are showning that they require premium fuel, and the Xcabs have some disclaimer saying the manual V6 "should use" premium, but yet it's listed as regular unleaded on the spec page (??) I thought they were the same engine (Dcab and Xcab). If they all require premium fuel, that is a huge no-no as far as I'm concerned.













BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

Post Edited (BajaTaco) : 10/30/2004 3:00:00 PM (GMT-8)

[bretedge]

Baja:


I looked at a new TRD Taco at the dealer yesterday. For the most part, I really like it. I noticed that the rear shock mounts are below the axle, pretty close to the inside of the rim. I'm no expert, but it looks like it's begging toget bashed by a rock.


Thanks for the info re: theDonahoe lift kits. I'mgettingthe new Taco (supercharged!)next year, but am considering a 5 - 6" lift w/ 35's instead of a 3" lift w/ 33's. I've got 9 or more months before I plunk down the cash. It'll be interesting to see what's available for it by the time I make the purchase.

[BajaTaco]

COTacoPhotog said...



Baja:


I looked at a new TRD Taco at the dealer yesterday. For the most part, I really like it. I noticed that the rear shock mounts are below the axle, pretty close to the inside of the rim. I'm no expert, but it looks like it's begging toget bashed by a rock.


Thanks for the info re: theDonahoe lift kits. I'mgettingthe new Taco (supercharged!)next year, but am considering a 5 - 6" lift w/ 35's instead of a 3" lift w/ 33's. I've got 9 or more months before I plunk down the cash. It'll be interesting to see what's available for it by the time I make the purchase.



Yea, a relocated shock mount should take care of that problem. But what a pain the in the butt. Another thing that will have to be taken care of is the cross-over exhaust - another rock magnet http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/shakehead.gif


5-6" lift with 35's? Hmmm... a supercharged Taco with 35's - if you plan to do any technical trails, I would take all of the cash you will sink into a drop bracket kit, and put it straight towards a solid axle swap. Better to do it up front than pay twice. Trust me. If you are going touse it for some mild trails here and there, then the lift kit will be fine, but otherwise you will tire quickly of broken parts and worn out steering stuff. Also, plan on having a pretty stout fuel bill (premium fuel, supercharged, and high rolling profile). Maybe you could be the first one to SAS an '05!!





BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[David A. Wright]

BajaTaco said...
Something I noticed is that all of the D-cabs are showning that they require premium fuel, and the Xcabs have some disclaimer saying the manual V6 "should use" premium, but yet it's listed as regular unleaded on the spec page (??) I thought they were the same engine (Dcab and Xcab). If they all require premium fuel, that is a huge no-no as far as I'm concerned.














Premium fuel would be a no-no in my book also. When I started seeing the new '05 Taco on the Net I immediately noticed the premium fuel requirements.

Take a look at the attached image for the fuel prices at a Chevron gas station in Lee Vining, California, on Saturday, October 30. This small town has traditionally the highest gas prices in my region, as it sits right at the eastern foot of the popular Tioga Pass route into Yosemite National Park. But these prices are "only" 40 cents higher than what I pay daily, which would still disqualify a vehicle requiring premium from my vehicle shopping list.

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[BajaTaco]

http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/freaked.gifhttp://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/shocked.gif http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/shakehead.gif


BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[David A. Wright]

I owned a '96 Cadillac DeVille Concours from new to December '02. The Northstar V8 engine in the Concours has 50 more horses than theonein the standard DeVille and requires premium (I don't know if the standard DeVille required premium or not). I know the feeling of paying more at the pump for premium gas and I'd rather not have to subject myself to that again.

The Toyota may be capable of running on regular, but the computer will likely change the engine's management parameters to compensate. Read less horsepower/torque.

Another reason I'll pass on the new generation of Tacoma is the 4x4 switch, which appears to be the only way they'll come. I don't like electronic activation of the front end. I guess I'm old fashioned, but I like the look and feel of levers.

My current Taco has the pushbutton 4x4 switch in the side of the transfer case lever. I didn't want that option, but I liked the way my truck was equipped otherwise, so tolerate it. My main gripe is when switching in 4x4 I get a loud CLUNK, which can be felt, when the front end engages if the truck is moving even slightly. If stopped, the front end doesn't engage unless everything just happened to be aligned correctly at the time. I've also accidentally engaged 4x4 when cleaning/vacuuming out the interior, then causing drivetrain windup when taking off foreward/reverse and turning. This twice has caused me to stall and experience difficulty unwinding the system so I can shift back to 2WD.

Otherwise I like the look of the new Taco. But certain specs turn me off. So I'll just keep mine. You still see a lot of 70s and 80s Toy trucks on the trail out there.

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[JackSilb]

Interesting point David. I can see how having the switch can be a pain.
Price of gas. Just made me feel a bit better about San Diego. Still .60 > Arizona.

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[David A. Wright]

When I was between 4x4's prior to '96 (when I bought my '96 Chevy S-10 4x4 pickup), I often rented 4x4s from my local Avis. They were all Chevy S-10 Blazers/GMC Jimmys and all were equipped with the pushbutton 4x4 activation. On more than one occassion I would engage the 4x4 button and found that it either was reluctant to engage (light in the button flashing) or indicating that I was in 4x4 and still sitting in one spot with the rear wheels spinning helplessly and the truck going nowhere. So when I bought my S-10, I made sure it had manual, lever activated 4x4.

And I've also changed my old habit of activating 4x4 before I need it instead of needing it and finding I don't have it due to not having all those parts in perfect alignment when I push the button ... http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/help.gif

Auto hubs are pretty much the norm now days, and I have been around long enough to have used for years the old Warn hubs, but I've found both trucks I've owned with auto hubs have been reliable. But I activate 4x4 regularly, thus keep them limber. The manuals in both of those trucks recommended so many miles of 4x4 use per month with an eye to keeping the front end parts well lubed. And thus I activate 4x4 even when going down a bladed dirt road.







David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

Post Edited (David A. Wright) : 11/5/2004 8:22:34 PM (GMT-8)

[David A. Wright]

Is it me, or are others of you out there irked by the new '05 Tacoma commercials?

Yes, they're kind of cute, but likely you notice that all involve crazy off road driving as a "cure" of some sort of emotional problems the person who gets the truck has.

I know that Toyota isn't the only manufacturer to show fast and irresponsible driving off road, but this campaign has me rather irked.

By the way, the iridescent blue '05 at my local dealer is gone, now replaced by two '05 Tacoma's - a silver Xtracab TRD equipped 4x4 and a white double cab, TRD equipped 4x4 unit.

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[FirstToy]

OK, the same confusion happened on the 03 4Runner with gas. The 4.0 V6 uses regular 87 gas. I have almost always used regular-- even at altitude in Big Bear I had no knocking or power loss. It gets great mpg's and the manual recommends premium [if you experience knocking or performance loss]. This is the exact same engine in the 05 Tacoma.

The electronic 4wd dial needs to be (1.pushed) in and (2. turned) and the dial itself has a raised lip so accidental engagement is impossible.
If you try to engage 4Lo without being in N, it will not allow it. There is minimal risk to your components. This maybe an 'idiot feature' but at least it will minimize damage if you do something stupid or otherwise.

Engagement is pretty seamless. It is a faint 'click' or otherwise non-existant. Many times it's just the dash light and steering feel of 4WD to tell you it's engaged in 4Hi (which can be done on-the-fly up to 60mph).

Also I'm not sure about the Tacoma, but the 4Runner can be left in 4wd full-time. You can run it as a full-time 4wd if you wish.

I love the new Taco commercials! They are a crackup!
'For 3 mochachino latte's a day and you can have your own Tacoma...won't you help stop truck bed abuse?' Hilarious!

[David A. Wright]

Went over to my Toyota dealer today on other business. While there, I got inside two of the new '05 Tacomas on the lot.

One was a 4x4 double cab. It was pretty loaded - a $30,000 price tag proved that. But, this was a TRD equipped truck and I could nowhere find a rear locker switch.

Another truck on the lot, a new one that wasn't there in the past few days, is a white Xtracab 4x4 TRD. This one has the 6-speed manual. It's locker switch is still on the left side of the dash, in with other switches (mirrors, fog lamps, clutch start cancel). This truck was stickered at nearly $27,000.

The truck appears to be somewhat larger from the outside, inside it seemed more wide than anything else.

So Iwent back to my white '02 Tacoma 4x4 TRD. 47,000+ miles, paid for. I think I got the better bargain ... http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans