Vehicle Range

[YukonBob]

A question was asked on another thread about the amount of extra gas to bring. That's a difficult question if you don't know the vehicle and the driver. I thought we should all post the mileage range of our vehicles so we'll know the weakest link on any trip.


My Yukon has a thirty gallon tank and I average about 12 miles per gallon for my type of dirt road driving and with the extra weight I carry. That gives me a range of about 340 miles. I can carry ten gallons of extra gas comfortably for an extra 120 miles. So myextended range is about 460 miles.

[GoodTimes]

My heep only holds 18 gallons. With conservative driving on open roads (meaning no rock crawling, blasting over dunes, drag racing, etc), I get around 16mpg. That gives me about 288 miles. I don't carry extra gas, as I have no room for it, and my jeep is not set up for long distance expeditions (and I have no intention of pulling a trailer with it).

So, I will be the weakest link when it comes to exteneded trips with limited gas availability. Everyone else seems to have roof racks and truck beds giving them room to carry extra gas.


olllllllo <---- If you can read that, roll me over.

KG6OWO

Price is soon forgotton, quality is not.

[WhiteThaiGer]

My numbers will change with the bigger tires now, getting even worsehttp://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/banghead.gif It used to be about 250miles + 70miles with extra 5 gallons. I've always been the first to need extra fuel, i.e used the 5 gal. on a number of occasions. </div>
Another benefit of carrying extra fuel is that you sometimes can sell it out there when your friends didn't bring enough and want to stay another day....http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/wink.gif </div>


***************************************
http://www.confluence.org
http://www.usgo.org

[Rockcrawler]

Goodtimes.... guess you should have held out for the Wrangler Unlimited... still haven't seen if it will come in Rubicon trim yet. There seems to be speculation both ways on that one. My range.... hmm... I would guess 250 or so in Z and in the Scrambler, I haven't a the foggiest as I've never really tracked it. I know I can play around all day out near Florence Junction and still have gas left to get to the trail head to tow it home! :)


"Paved Roads: Another example of wasteful government spending." KD7UEH

[expeditionswest]

Here are my details:</div>
Trooper: 23 gallon tank, 15mpg off highway, mixed terrain. 345 miles. I can carry15 gallons on the rack. 570 total</div>
Discovery: 25 gallon tank, 11mpg off highway, mixed terrain. 275 miles. I can carry15 gallons on the rack.440 total</div>
Jeep Wrangler: 20 gallon tank, 14mpg off highway, mixed terrain. 280 miles total. No rack provision

Expedition Tent Trailer: Adds 10 gallons of capacity, but costs 2 mpg to the tow vehicle. adds ~100 miles to Trooper and Jeep range.



After everyone adds their vehicles, we should put together a simple spreadsheet for trip leaders to reference.

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[BajaTaco]

My current range with mixed use (incl. 4wdtrails) is about 420 miles.

It used to be about 480 before I put the MTR tires on http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

I am considering getting a can for the roof rack just to have extra in case myself or anyone else needs it.


http://www.bajataco.com

[JackSilb]

Here is mine.
My gas light comes on after about 15 gallons were used. In theory, I still have 3 more gallons left. Never tested it.

I can do about 230 miles with 15 gallons on the HW. I have not measure it on the dirt with 19 PSI on the tires.

I am starting to carry 10 gallons extra for the trips that I know gas will be a problem. Well, did twice so far on Baja and ElGolfo.

-JACK
</div>


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[blupaddler]

With my truck I get about the same as WhiteThaiGer...

about 220-260 depending on driving conditions and stuff. I carry one extra gas can giving me an extra 60-70 miles or so.

Although, I am looking at having a rack made to go above my cab to hold 2 or 3 gas cans and 2 or three water cans also, along with extras, not too sure yet, still in the planning stages. Scott I would be interested to see how you carry your three cans. Oh, the reason for above the cab is with my Wildernest I don't want to put anything up there that is too heavy, so I don't have to take it down at night to set up the tent.

robb

[expeditionswest]

I have a fully welded con-ferr rack. I use ratchet straps to secure the tanks. I use the traditional jerry cans, but have not been very happy with their sealing capability. I will eventually replace all of them with the nato style.</div>
My preferred method of carrying fuel is on my trailer though. I have the nato fuel cans with the heavy cages that the fuel slides into. Like this-</div>
Another cool tool is the super-siphon. That thing ROCKS http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/supercool.gif http://www.baproducts.com/siphon.htm</div>

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[David A. Wright]

I don't carry extra fuel, but often have thought about it.

I've yet to run out of gas, but have often worried about it and have gone out of my way to run to a nearby town to top off just in case.

I hate being far from civilization with the gas gauge less than a half tank. My whole focus is on watching the gauge and not on enjoying what's around me.

My Taco's low gas light has come on a couple of times, which really gets my "worst case scenario" juices flowing. And when I fill up I find that I've still got 50-60 miles left. Annoying.

What I'm trying to say here is that I've often thought about carrying extra fuel but have not studied it well nor sought advise on it. Some questions.

1.) Steel Jerry cans best?

2.) Where is the best place to mount a can ina pickup truck?

In carrying a 7-gallon water jug with me on trips, I find that if I put the water in the rear of the bed, I can feel the negative impact of the weight far rearward. I would assume if I'm carrying a 5-gallon Jerry can I would want to have it as far forward as possible. But with a camper shell it would be a pain to extract for use. But ...

Any suggestions?

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[MrS]

David A. Wright said...


My Taco's low gas light has come on a couple of times, which really gets my "worst case scenario" juices flowing. And when I fill up I find that I've still got 50-60 miles left. Annoying.


1.) Steel Jerry cans best?

2.) Where is the best place to mount a can ina pickup truck?

In carrying a 7-gallon water jug with me on trips, I find that if I put the water in the rear of the bed, I can feel the negative impact of the weight far rearward. I would assume if I'm carrying a 5-gallon Jerry can I would want to have it as far forward as possible. But with a camper shell it would be a pain to extract for use. But ...

Any suggestions?






Dave short note on the low-fuel-light. On my taco (2001) I've found I can travel 12 to 30 miles after it comes on. The time I ran out, coasting into a gas station,it only took about 16.7 gals to fill up http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/notme.gif

A few trips ago I ran out maybe an 1/8to a 1/4 mile from the gas station. Since a redlight would have made me stop, I couldn't coast into the station. Lucky I carry exrta fuel. http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/ok-kewl.gif


As far as gas cans go, I like 2 1/2 gal plastic. They seal good, easy to pour, and light. I carry my fuel cans on my roof rack, I don't want fuel smell on my camping gear. BTW, you can't buy good non-leaking fuel cans here anymore. http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/shakehead.gif I have an upcoming fuel can test this weekend, I may have more info about this later.

Dave; I'd like your comment on "carrying water vs truck loading", but would like to start a 'water tank' topic. Would you start a new one? or mind me moving you comment?

4 Wheeling; n (sl) 1. Enjoying the journey
as much,if not more than the destination.
2. Gods way of saying you have too much $$

[David A. Wright]

Might as well make a new topic out of it.


When I go out on a multi-day trip, I carry a 7-gallon water containor with a spiggot. I bought it at WalMart about five years ago or so. Spiggot leaks a bit, but I simply carry the jug withit in an upright position. It was pretty cheap and it's worn well.

Before I go on a trip, I wash out the jug and fill it with some bleach to disinfect and let it sit for a few days before I put it to use.

I camp in the back of my truck, everything in tote boxes. When time comes to camp, I just stack the boxes around my truck. Since I'm not accessing the water all the time, it's fine that the jug sits in the front of the bed. It's strapped down to keep it from falling over or sliding around. For water needs on the fly, I generally keep a gallon jug of drinking water in a tote box I keep at the rear of the bed, plus a few litre bottles in the cab (pockets under the rear flipout windows hold two bottles nicely).

You can see the blue jug sitting in the left corner in front of one of the two tote boxes I keep permanently in the truck. This was on the Monache Meadows trip I took with Cecile and Roger this past summer.







David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

Post Edited (David A. Wright) : 10/21/2004 10:42:46 AM (GMT-8)

[YukonBob]

[quote]

David said...I don't carry extra fuel, but often have thought about it.


I've yet to run out of gas, but have often worried about it and have gone out of my way to run to a nearby town to top off just in case.
What's the range of your vehicle. MPG X tank size.

[David A. Wright]

YukonBob said... What's the range of your vehicle. MPG X tank size.
About 350 miles. 19.5 gallons x 18mpg average.

A lot of my concern is just plain mental - I dislike strongly knowing I'm a very long way from a gas station and seeing my gas gauge swinging below a half tank.

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[BajaTaco]

[quote]

David A. Wright said...

[quote]
19.5 gallons Really? I thought they were 18.5 gallons.



BAJATACO.COM (http://bajataco.com)

[David A. Wright]

[quote]

BajaTaco said...
Really? I thought they were 18.5 gallons.
Ugh! You're right! I just went out and consulted the manual. I thought I had read that the capacity was 19.5 back when I bought the truck and read through the manual, and have assumed that the case to this day. DUH! http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/banghead.gif

Let's see, refiguring range ... 18.5 gallons x 18mpg average ... http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/eek2.gif

David A. Wright
Great Basin Research
"Happy Trails to You, Until We Meet Again" - Roy Rogers and Dale Evans

[MarxF350]

Okay, I know this is an old post, but I can't resist adding my 2 cents:
55gal + 5gal jerry can x 15mpg = 900 miles

OutbacKamper:
2003, F350, CC, SB, SRW, 7.3L Diesel, Auto, 4x4, XLT, Sport, Mods: Bullbar, Winch, Driving lights, Snorkle, Fr & Rr Diff Locks, On board air & 3 gal tank, 55 gal fuel tank, Espar D5, HD front springs, 295/75-16 BFG AT x5, Stereo/iPod, Custom Centre Console, Sound deadening, Vinyl floor, Locking drawer under seat, cargo carrier.
2004 4Wheel Campers 'Hawk' shell model with custom interior (in progress)

[Flyin'Hawaiian]

Well! You woulda been able to drive from Los Angeles to Portland, Oregon with only a stop to put your 5 gal. jerry can in, and one more to finish the other 80 miles! That must be incredibly heavy, 60 gallons of fuel on the back! That's about 360 lbs iirc!!!

http://www.kolohe.net/art/sig01.jpg

'85 Supra, 6mg2te, yes, there's two of 'em!
'87 SR5, Trailmaster and DOA engine, lotsa other stuff!
'05 Tacoma double cab, TRD offroad package w/the new V6 and a 6 speed stick.

[Rockcrawler]

I suppose I could update mine now too... 34 gallons at avg 17.5 mpg puts me at 595 miles with the CTD. The Jeep I have a 15 gallon tank and two 5 gallon jerry cans at approx 13 mpg (total guess on this....) that puts me at 325 miles.


"Paved Roads: Another example of wasteful government spending." KD7UEH

[MarxF350]

Flyin'Hawaiian said...
Well! You woulda been able to drive from Los Angeles to Portland, Oregon with only a stop to put your 5 gal. jerry can in, and one more to finish the other 80 miles! That must be incredibly heavy, 60 gallons of fuel on the back! That's about 360 lbs iirc!!!

Not to nit pick, but I think diesel is 7lb per gallon, 60x7=420lb. I know it takes a long time to fill the tank!
Mark

OutbacKamper:
2003, F350, CC, SB, SRW, 7.3L Diesel, Auto, 4x4, XLT, Sport, Mods: Bullbar, Winch, Driving lights, Snorkle, Fr & Rr Diff Locks, On board air & 3 gal tank, 55 gal fuel tank, Espar D5, HD front springs, 295/75-16 BFG AT x5, Stereo/iPod, Custom Centre Console, Sound deadening, Vinyl floor, Locking drawer under seat, cargo carrier.
2004 4Wheel Campers 'Hawk' shell model with custom interior (in progress)

[HenryJ]

Thought I'd add my set-up to the mix- Auxillary fuel tank (http://www.fmtc.com/~brule/tank.html)

I don't like running on the bottom side of 1/2 tank, especially with the less than perfect GM sender, so I usually figure on a 500 mile range. I do have four 5 gal. cans I could add to extend that, but the rigs I travel with usually have a smaller range, so why?

This set up is one of the best things that I have done. The only time it hurts is when you fill up with the current fuel prices.

'Speed is just a matter of Money - How fast do YOU </font>want to go?'-mechanic from Mad Max-</font>

If at first you don't succeed - Don't take up Skydiving!</font> - ThunderII (http://fmtc.com/~brule/thunder2.html)

[bufeo]

Well now, I hadn't noticed this thread before, so thanks MarxF350 for bringing it out of the closet.

Our F250 SD dieselcomes with a 38 gal tank and we added a Transferflow 50 gal to the bed (tool box on top). We're getting 16.8 mpg on a round trip from Prescott to Punta Bufeo--remember about120 miles of that in on that great road from San Felipe to PB and back. That gives us a range of, let's see now, 16.8 times 88 gal....ummmm. Well, doggone, that's one thousand four hundred seventy-eight point four miles (1478.4 for those who like to see the real numbers) http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/supercool.gif .

Yeah, we know; we can't get to the places some of you and your Toys can. That's okay; we'll bring the chuck wagon along and the extra cases ofhttp://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/beertoast.gif .

Since diesel has been the equivalent of $1.60/gal (using the great 11.8p/1$ we got last spring and banked it), we've been purchasing diesel in San Felipe, driving back to Prescott, returning to Punta Bufeo, then re-filling in San Felipe on the return trip. I love it.http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/hop.gif

Now I don't know about this little 2001Xterra we've purchased. It has a 19.375 gal tank and we haven't had it long enough to really test the mileage. On a trip down to Phoenix and back last week we averaged only 17.2 mpg, but I kept it at 70 - 75 mph most of the way (where it was legal of course). Thatcomputes to a 333.25 mile range. My guess is that the little V6 won't do that well at the low speeds of backcountry travel. 15-16 mpg I reckon. That will give us a range of 290-310 miles. I guess that's all right.We just won't arrive at camp with as much http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/beertoast.gif for the groupthat's all.http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/cry.gif

Here's to meeting good people on bad roads!

[MarxF350]

Hey FLYWGN;
What if you replace your 38 gal tank with a transfer flow 57 and add an Aerotank 30 gallon to the spare tire area:
(57+50+30) x 16.8 = 2301.6 miles, now thats long range /forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif
16.8mpg average is pretty good for a Powerstoke, is that a 7.3 or 6.0l ?

OutbacKamper:
2003, F350, CC, SB, SRW, 7.3L Diesel, Auto, 4x4, XLT, Sport, Mods: Bullbar, Winch, Driving lights, Snorkle, Fr & Rr Diff Locks, On board air & 3 gal tank, 55 gal fuel tank, Espar D5, HD front springs, 295/75-16 BFG AT x5, Stereo/iPod, Custom Centre Console, Sound deadening, Vinyl floor, Locking drawer under seat, cargo carrier.
2004 4Wheel Campers 'Hawk' shell model with custom interior (in progress)

[Rockcrawler]

Well if you plan on it making a 2301.6 mile trip... its gotta be the 7.3!!! Sorry, couldn't resist. For those that don't know, the 6.0 engines have been plagued with problems since their introduction. I think Ford/International are finally getting things under control though. I saw a JD Power report the other day... it was showing that the Chevy and Dodge Diesel engines had something like 30 or 40 fewer problems per 1000 as compared to the available gas engines and the 6.0 liter had several hundred more!


"Paved Roads: Another example of wasteful government spending." KD7UEH

[expeditionswest]

For my 2004 Tacoma

Main: 18.5
Aux: 22
Total: 40.5
MPG Highway 17
Range Est: 688 miles

I can also carry two 6 gallon nato fuelcansmountedin the bed.(though I typically put water in the cages) add that in and I am at:
nearly 900 miles!

The 688 I more than enought though IMO. Weight becomes a factor much sooner for me than these full size guys http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Scott Brady
mailto:guide@expeditionswest.com (guide@expeditionswest.com)
http://www.expeditionswest.com

[bufeo]

MarxF350 said...
Hey FLYWGN;
What if you replace your 38 gal tank with a transfer flow 57 and add an Aerotank 30 gallon to the spare tire area:
(57+50+30) x 16.8 = 2301.6 miles, now thats long range /forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif
16.8mpg average is pretty good for a Powerstoke, is that a 7.3 or 6.0l ?


Marx-
Sounds crazy, but I actually considered those mods you suggest http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/rolleyes.gif . Diana is already worried that I won't make enough "pit" stops. A 2300-mile-range would be frightnening.

It's the 6.0 l engine, Rockcrawler's caveats notwithstanding.



Here's to meeting good people on bad roads!

[crawler#976]

My MPG and range varies hugely due to tire pressure.

On thestreet @ 25 PSI it'll get 18 to 16 MPG, normal dirt roadin' @ 14 PSI it drops to 14 to 12 MPG, and at below 8 PSI it drops WAY down- below 10 MPG. With 16.5 gallon tank, I max out at about 260 miles at street pressure.

My last trail trip in the snow covered 108 miles and use 10.2 gallons...the first 40 miles were at 10 PSI, the last 68 were at 5 PSI.

Icarry a 2.5 gallon can all the time- if needed, it should get me an additional 25 to40 miles closer to a gas station.

So far, the gas and many of my other supplies like 10W-30 oil, 90W gear oil, and anti-freeze/water have been used by other people, not myself. One of my buddies punched a hole thru an oil pan, one lost a drian plug on a third member, and I've helped several people on the hwy that needed gas or anti-freeze/water.

As a side note, my ol' 1970 GMC shortbed 4x4 had an 1100 mile range. The 22.5 gallon seat tank w/ guage was my reserve, the main tank was a 55 gallon toolbox/tank in the bed. Back when gas was $1.33, it wasn't uncommon for me to drop a $100.00 bill to fill up- used to crack me up to walk in and tell'm to keep the change http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[HongerVenture]

Surely I'm not the only one keeping a running record of my gas mileage... http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/biggrin.gif Or maybe I'm just a major geek! http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/confused2.gif

In any case, my truck which sees about half surface street/half highway use averages at 17mpg. I'll assume that loaded in the camping/off-road use it will average out at 15 mpg (kind of a pessimistic guess).

15 mpg x 24 gallon tank = 360 miles

I'd like to carry between 5 and 10 gallons extra in cans for extended trips, but at this point in time don't need it. Won't have a need for it on our Colorado trip either so it isn't a near future plan. For now I keep a 1 gallon plastic jug on me at all times... just in case ya' know.

-Toyota T100 SR5 4x4 XtraCab-
-WHITE-

[kellymoe]

My Rover gets just about 200 miles per tank if I have a tail wind and driving down hill. I carry 2-3 NATO 5 gal cans. I am sold on the NATO cans, with the cam lock top I have never had a problem with leaks and have on occasion carried them inside my Range Rover before I sold it with no fumes.

[blupaddler]

My FZJ80 gets around 11-13 mpg, dropping considerably less when off-road, and trying to keep up with all the speed demons on the freeways these days.

11 x 25 gallons = 275

I have one nato can, but I don't carry it unless the trip I am going on will be longer trip where I know gas will be scarce.

I am currently looking at adding either a 44 gallon aux. tank or upgrading my 24 to a 38. I am still considering other factors though, most importantly clearance.

/forum/emoticons/beertoast.gif

WHERE 2 NEXT

robb

[datrupr]

My Trooper has a 22.5 gallon tank and I average about 15-16 mpg or a range of just over 300 miles. I know that that number will drop as the mods to the Trooper get added. I do not generally carry any extra fuel on trips, have not had a need to yet. I know I am a little late on this post but but I thouhgt I woupd get my 2cents in.http://www.4wdtrips.net/forum/emoticons/cool.gif


Aaron

DATRUPR

[IceWalker]

I'm probably about the same as Scott with My Discovery - When I did the trip up to Tuk at the beginning of this year I also carried an additional 20 gallons of gas.

One Idea I did see while up in the Northwest territories - was an additional tank that was roof rack mounted on an old Land Cruiser. The guy had taken a marine fuel tank and strapped it to his roof rack with an auxilliary fuel feed running either into the tank or onto a solenoid valve to switch between primary and auxilliary tank. not sure how legal this setup is - but it sure saves lugging jerry cans down from the roof rack for the middle of no-where fill up.

regards

Jeff

[cruiser guy]

Go diesel!! I've got a 20 gallon tank (more or less) and get over 20mpg (I think it's close to 25 but lets say 20 to be safe) thats a 400 mile range on all stock tanks and no on board jerry cans. For folks familiar with B.C. and Alberta I have driven from Abbotsford, B.C. (just east of Vancouver) to Hinton Alberta (just east of Jasper) on one tank of fuel!! That's a fairly long day of highway driving. The fuel comsumption of the diesel doesn't vary much from empty to fully loaded.

I know diesel is unfairly priced in both Canada and the states being at the same level as premium gasoline but it's still cheaper in the long run. In Mexico and Guatemala diesel is about 70 - 80% of regular gas which is where it seems to be in much of the rest of the world as well.

driving an '82 Toyota LandCruiser BJ60 registered in British Columbia, Canada with only 400,000km on the clock!!
Yes, I drove here to Guatemala City!

[JackSilb]

Diesel. When my engine dies I will try to get one for my TLC. I hope by then it will be OK to have it in California. At least in a 10+ year old truck.

-JACK


So much to see, so little time. Try using your 4WD tosee and do more.
Tread Lightly! empowers generations to enjoy the outdoors responsibly...
http://www.4wdtrips.net

[xxxpedition]

well, i have a 20gal tank on my xj
i usually get about 220-240 miles with it. on the dalton highway in alaska, however, i was never going over 55mph and slowed down on the hills and almost got 300 m with one tank...

xxxpedition.com
http://xxxpedition.com/xxx-logo-pics/rig01.jpg

[TimB]

My jeep does very good on gas. I don't really do enough highway driving to know how it does there, but in the 900 mile adventure last week I had an overall average of 11.5 MPG. Not bad considering all the low range and that I run 8.5 psi tire pressure off-road.

I can fix that!

[HenryJ]

After the addition of the 'Brady inspired' Isuzu tank ( Bottom of the page (http://www.fmtc.com/~brule/tank.html) ), I made it 780 miles before filling. I still had over a 1/4 tank left, but hate to run the main tank that low. It took 48 gallons to fill all three tanks. That puts the mileage around 16.25, with as cold as it has been, and primarily city / offroad driving.

The tool box tank is easily removeable and is designed to extend the range of my boat as well. I may remove it at some point, but for now the additional weight is not hurting the mileage and may be a benefit during the winter. It really is comforting to have a point of no return out as far as 400 miles. This allows me to choose when and where to refuel. With the huge swings in fuel prices that has been fun. I can wait a month and see if the prices drop before refueling :biggrin: Not to mention the extended desert trips with no worrying about fuel availability.

'Speed is just a matter of Money - How fast do YOU </font>want to go?'-mechanic from Mad Max-</font>

If at first you don't succeed - Don't take up Skydiving!</font> - ThunderII (http://fmtc.com/~brule/thunder2.html) KE7CSK

[PinzEOD]

That's a sweet set-up. I've considered using a marine tank for more capacity, especially with the wide variety of shapes and sizes available. A jeeper in a local club talked me out of it because of liability issues, the marine tank not being DOT approved. So I steered away from the idea. Might the one you used be both DOT and marine approved?


Curb appeal I lack, but the rocks don't seem to mind.
Me
Principles are a dangerous form of social dynamite.
Katharine Anthony

[IceWalker]

Are fuel cells dot legal? Wondered wether it would be fine to install something along the lines of a fuel-safe cell - something like they have in Motor Racing?

Jeff

[calamaridog]

Couple of thoughts.

I certainly wish I had extended range on my vehicle. I can go around 300 mi. or so and carry a 5 gallon Jerry Can. Not hardly impressive.

I am concerned however with the installation of an additional tank behind the rear axle. The potential for a tank rupture if you are rear ended is very high, depending upon the design of the system. A tank rupture can have catastrophic effects (FIRE).

I would pay extra attention to detail when making any changes. I am still undecided about making this change myself.

I wonder if you could improve the survivability of the tank by having it Line-X'd or something similar.

2000 UZJ100 Land Cruiser - 2002 Jeep Liberty 4x4</font></font>

Member: TLCA, TTORA, Blue Ribbon Coalition</font></font>

[cruiser guy]

Fire and explosion are one of the concerns with extended range gasoline tanks. For those of us running diesel it's not such a big deal since diesel is not nearly as explosive as gasoline. I doubt Line-X would help much since it's sparks from the crash that will set off gasoline.

driving an '82 Toyota LandCruiser BJ60 registered in British Columbia, Canada with only 430,000km on the clock!!
Yes, I drove here to Guatemala City!

[HenryJ]

PinzEOD said...
... Might the one you used be both DOT and marine approved?I don't believe it is. It only carries the Marine board seal and a specification label that states the certification test pressure and approval for storage of gasoline or diesel fuels.

I have installed many automotive fuel cells without issue. The difference other than UV resistance and color, is the marine tanks are nearly twice as thick as the automotive fuel cells and the ones I have seen have no provisions for adding foam as a baffle.

I would imagine that the expense to seek DOT and Marine certifications would price a tank out of range for most and did not research that.

In Oregon fuel can only be dispensed into approved containers. This is an approved container. Properly secured and vented I see no hazard. If I should ever be questioned, it is removeable and can be used in my boat.

I did consider the location of the 'behind rear axle' tank. Mine is protected by the hitch which serves to protect the tank. It is also mounted in such a fashion that it can be pushed forward in a collision. Some thought did go into the method and position in which it was mounted.

Is there a risk to carrying more fuel? Sure. Everything has risks. We do our best to weight the risk vs the benefits and do what makes sense. Many vehicles have between rails rear mounted tanks. Pintos gave them a bad name. Some of that was location, but most of it was the vehicle design and tank itself.

Obviously passing an inspection might pose a risk. Documenting the ability of the evap system to properly handle the added capacity would be hard to do if even possible. From what little research that I have done, aftermarket outfitters shy away from the fuel systems for this reason. That does not preclude the owners from making their own modifications though.

I have not heard of any legislation dealing with this specifically in the state of Oregon. While I may have to plead ignorance in this issue I realize that is no excuse. I have no worries about the modifications that I have made. They may indeed be safer than some alternatives.

'Speed is just a matter of Money - How fast do YOU </font>want to go?'-mechanic from Mad Max-</font>

If at first you don't succeed - Don't take up Skydiving!</font> - ThunderII (http://fmtc.com/~brule/thunder2.html) KE7CSK

[calamaridog]

Henry,

You bring up a valid point regarding the thought you have put into the system and the additional protection offered by the receiver hitch. Obviously, you have designed a well thought out system. I think you also mentioned a future skid plate?

I don't care for the rear mounted tanks in general, such as on my Jeep Liberty, and these are primary tanks, not 'long range' tanks. The chances of you running around town every day with that rear tank full seems low. No gas = no risk. The chance of being rear ended in the bush seems fairly low too, so again, little risk.

Ford has another 'Pinto' called the Crown Victoria. This is the most popular service vehicle with Law Enforcement agencies. These vehicles have a known fatal flaw when they are rear ended, the tank often ruptures against the rear axle due to faulty design. They have been retrofitting these for a few years now.

Charles, my thinking regarding the Line-X are simply to improve the chances the tank may not rupture at all. Spark won't cause fire without fuel or something along those lines.

In CA I'm fairly certain most added tanks would not be legal but I have not researched this yet. Regardless, the tank could be removed for the sale of the vehicle so no harm no foul.

2000 UZJ100 Land Cruiser - 2002 Jeep Liberty 4x4</font></font>

Member: TLCA, TTORA, Blue Ribbon Coalition</font></font>

[IceWalker]

I always thought that a semi empty gas tank would pose more of a risk since there would be more room for fuel vapor and hence in a rear end accident the fuel vapors would be more prone to explosion in the even of a spark/fire. Hence one of the reasons that alot of racing tanks have foam baffles.


Jeff

[HenryJ]

The location that I mounted the Isuzu tank is very close to the position it was mounted in the Trooper. I do intend to mount the factory Isuzu shield. This would help should the tank scrub on declination.

The full tank empty tank debate is a tough one. An empty tank has less support from the liquid fuel. Liquid does not compress as readily as air. While the empty tank could potentially spark and ignite easier, I would think the lack of fuel would not sustain the fire.

Here's an interesting fact: 1 gallon of gasoline has the same heat release as one stick of dynamite.

I am a member of our state regional hazardous material response team. We are dispatched through the State Fire Marshals Office. There are several 'automatic responses' one of which is a potential to release 42 gallons or more. This is dependent upon the threat to the public or environment of course. Last fill for me was 48 gallons!

I am confident that there would not be a release without a MAJOR incident.

Having been a underground storage tank removal supervisor, I have a pretty good feel for the narrow the flammable range of gasoline. Thank goodness we don't run on acetlyene or ethelyene oxide /forum/emoticons/smilewinkgrin.gif

I do not want to minimize the potential here, but as stated above there are some vehicles that may be at higher risk. Think of the '73-late '80's Chevrolet full size trucks. The tanks were mounted outside the protection of the frame. While there was indeed some sort of settlement in this case, I don't believe they are seen as being death traps.

'Speed is just a matter of Money - How fast do YOU </font>want to go?'-mechanic from Mad Max-</font>

If at first you don't succeed - Don't take up Skydiving!</font> - ThunderII (http://fmtc.com/~brule/thunder2.html) KE7CSK

Post Edited (HenryJ) : 11/22/2005 8:23:48 PM (GMT-8)